[FG]

Why does IE run a secret window??

I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when the IE
Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run after I
have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is still a
copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that task,
the program will then run its clean up...

Thanks,
FG

[Roger Abell]

I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.

It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.

--
Roger Abell
Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)

"FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> Why does IE run a secret window??
>
> I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when the IE
> Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run after I
> have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is still a
> copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that task,
> the program will then run its clean up...
>
> Thanks,
> FG
>
>

[FG]

Roger,

Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no "black
helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)

Thanks,
FG

"Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>
> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>
> --
> Roger Abell
> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>
> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> > Why does IE run a secret window??
> >
> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when the
IE
> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run after
I
> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is still
a
> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
task,
> > the program will then run its clean up...
> >
> > Thanks,
> > FG
> >
> >
>
>

[Imhotep]

FG wrote:

> Roger,
>
> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no "black
> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
>
> Thanks,
> FG
>
> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>>
>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>>
>> --
>> Roger Abell
>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>>
>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
>> >
>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when the
> IE
>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run after
> I
>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
>> > still
> a
>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
> task,
>> > the program will then run its clean up...
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > FG
>> >
>> >
>>
>>

Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...

[Roger Abell [MVP]]

"Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
news:Qt_ue.3272$8o.904@fed1read03...
> FG wrote:
>
>> Roger,
>>
>> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no "black
>> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> FG
>>
>> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
>> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
>>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
>>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
>>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
>>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
>>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
>>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>>>
>>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Roger Abell
>>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>>>
>>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
>>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
>>> >
>>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when the
>> IE
>>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run
>>> > after
>> I
>>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
>>> > still
>> a
>>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
>> task,
>>> > the program will then run its clean up...
>>> >
>>> > Thanks,
>>> > FG
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>
> Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...

Perhaps you do not, but then apparently you spend more time
with the marketing side than the engineers/devs
--
ra

[Imhotep]

Roger Abell [MVP] wrote:

> "Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
> news:Qt_ue.3272$8o.904@fed1read03...
>> FG wrote:
>>
>>> Roger,
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no "black
>>> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> FG
>>>
>>> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
>>> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
>>>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
>>>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
>>>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
>>>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
>>>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
>>>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>>>>
>>>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Roger Abell
>>>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>>>>
>>>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>>>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
>>>> >
>>>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when
>>>> > the
>>> IE
>>>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run
>>>> > after
>>> I
>>>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
>>>> > still
>>> a
>>>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
>>> task,
>>>> > the program will then run its clean up...
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks,
>>>> > FG
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>> Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...
>
> Perhaps you do not, but then apparently you spend more time
> with the marketing side than the engineers/devs

Actually I thought the same of you. Much more of a Marketer than an
Engineer. Then again most Vendor Partners are...

-Im

[Imhotep]

Roger Abell [MVP] wrote:

> "Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
> news:Qt_ue.3272$8o.904@fed1read03...
>> FG wrote:
>>
>>> Roger,
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no "black
>>> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> FG
>>>
>>> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
>>> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
>>>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
>>>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
>>>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
>>>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
>>>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
>>>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>>>>
>>>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Roger Abell
>>>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>>>>
>>>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>>>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
>>>> >
>>>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when
>>>> > the
>>> IE
>>>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run
>>>> > after
>>> I
>>>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
>>>> > still
>>> a
>>>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
>>> task,
>>>> > the program will then run its clean up...
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks,
>>>> > FG
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>> Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...
>
> Perhaps you do not, but then apparently you spend more time
> with the marketing side than the engineers/devs


....and besides are you really suggesting that Microsoft products do not have
"phone home" software "included"????

[Mark Randall]

*cuts out the malformed rubbish*

You will find that many applications spawn seperate windows to create a new
hWND for the WindProc system, which Async and event driven winsock
applications relly on to function correctly, occasionally these fail to die,
keeping the thread open.

--
- Mark Randall
http://zetech.swehli.com

[Imhotep]

Mark Randall wrote:

> *cuts out the malformed rubbish*
>
> You will find that many applications spawn seperate windows to create a
> new hWND for the WindProc system, which Async and event driven winsock
> applications relly on to function correctly, occasionally these fail to
> die, keeping the thread open.
>

Translated bad code (bug). You're a little late to the party. That has
already been said. Next, I said That is probably it but with Microsoft you
never know...

Please read the parent threads first...

-Im

[Roger Abell]

"Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
news:4slve.4319$8o.2907@fed1read03...
> Roger Abell [MVP] wrote:
>
> > "Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
> > news:Qt_ue.3272$8o.904@fed1read03...
> >> FG wrote:
> >>
> >>> Roger,
> >>>
> >>> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no
"black
> >>> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> FG
> >>>
> >>> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
> >>> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> >>>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
> >>>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
> >>>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
> >>>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
> >>>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
> >>>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
> >>>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
> >>>>
> >>>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Roger Abell
> >>>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
> >>>>
> >>>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> >>>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
> >>>> >
> >>>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when
> >>>> > the
> >>> IE
> >>>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run
> >>>> > after
> >>> I
> >>>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
> >>>> > still
> >>> a
> >>>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end that
> >>> task,
> >>>> > the program will then run its clean up...
> >>>> >
> >>>> > Thanks,
> >>>> > FG
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >> Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...
> >
> > Perhaps you do not, but then apparently you spend more time
> > with the marketing side than the engineers/devs
>
>
> ...and besides are you really suggesting that Microsoft products do not
have
> "phone home" software "included"????
>


First, I am neither a vendor, nor a partner.
I am a mathematician, computer scientist, and chemist,
amongst other things.
I made no comments about "phone home", and I do not
much care for marketeering nor being lumped therewith !

If you have read the Eula you would know what people
have concented to and what they have been warranted
will not happen.

Why would any corp, any software vendor do something
outside of their agreements that can be so simply detected
as simply running a box in a monitored, screen network?

OTOH, some of the things you are seen saying makes it
pretty clear that you have not met many of the people that
are building Windows.

--
Roger

[Imhotep]

Roger Abell wrote:

> "Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
> news:4slve.4319$8o.2907@fed1read03...
>> Roger Abell [MVP] wrote:
>>
>> > "Imhotep" <NoSpam@NoThanks.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Qt_ue.3272$8o.904@fed1read03...
>> >> FG wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Roger,
>> >>>
>> >>> Thank you very much for the reply.. I find it a pain, but if no
> "black
>> >>> helicopters" are lurking, then I will not worry about it. :)
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks,
>> >>> FG
>> >>>
>> >>> "Roger Abell" <mvpNOSpam@asu.edu> wrote in message
>> >>> news:eQ4W90OeFHA.3328@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> I have noticed the same residual IE processes for the past few minor
>> >>>> revs of IE 6, and for IE5, and reported same to MS. This happens
>> >>>> after one has used IE for an extended time, especially if opening a
>> >>>> number of "new windows" to the point of exhausting the systems
>> >>>> heap space for user objects. Whether right or wrong, I describe
>> >>>> this as IE "leaking" threads - which supposedly is something that
>> >>>> cannot happen, a process ending and leaving child threads alive.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> It is not some black helicopter affair, just bad code.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> --
>> >>>> Roger Abell
>> >>>> Microsoft MVP (Windows Security)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "FG" <NQUQICYJQBOC@spammotel.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:BFVue.956$wm.119@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>> >>>> > Why does IE run a secret window??
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > I run a program that kills cookies, temp internet files, etc when
>> >>>> > the
>> >>> IE
>> >>>> > Browser is closed.. There are times with the program does not run
>> >>>> > after
>> >>> I
>> >>>> > have closed the browser.. Upon checking the task manager there is
>> >>>> > still
>> >>> a
>> >>>> > copy of IE running (although invisible to the user) When I end
>> >>>> > that
>> >>> task,
>> >>>> > the program will then run its clean up...
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>> > FG
>> >>>> >
>> >>>> >
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>
>> >> Well, it is Microsoft, you really never know...
>> >
>> > Perhaps you do not, but then apparently you spend more time
>> > with the marketing side than the engineers/devs
>>
>>
>> ...and besides are you really suggesting that Microsoft products do not
> have
>> "phone home" software "included"????
>>
>
>
> First, I am neither a vendor, nor a partner.
> I am a mathematician, computer scientist, and chemist,
> amongst other things.
> I made no comments about "phone home", and I do not
> much care for marketeering nor being lumped therewith !

....nor do I like being "lumped" in the marketing group.

> If you have read the Eula you would know what people
> have concented to and what they have been warranted
> will not happen.

So, anything is ok if it is written in small type and is riddled in "lawyer
speak"? this is a lame excuse. The simple fact that Windows has dial home
software is inexcusable. More and more Microsoft is pushing the envelope of
what they can get away with. Ask yourself this. Why bury the fact that they
are using such meathods in the EULA. It seems to me that it would clearly
be listed and displayed on the MS web site...per product.

> Why would any corp, any software vendor do something
> outside of their agreements that can be so simply detected
> as simply running a box in a monitored, screen network?

Your point is that since it is in the EULA it is OK. My point is that, that
does not make it OK. Get it? You know as well as I, most people do not even
read the EULA...The EULA is just a "cover-all" legal maneuver where the
company puts information that they do not want the "average user" to
notice. Then, down the road, they can simply reference it by saying "did
you not read the EULA"?

Again, my challenge to Microsoft is put all that information clearly on
their web site and do not try to bury it. You only need to bury information
if you are trying to "sneak one by" your customers.

> OTOH, some of the things you are seen saying makes it
> pretty clear that you have not met many of the people that
> are building Windows.
>

Oh, how little you know....funny how you assume things. You claim you are a
"chemist, mathematician, etc" but you clearly ignore the general rule of
science..."Never make such bold assumptions based on little fact". I guess
we all have things to learn in life. Maybe someday this will not elude you.

- Imhotep