Re: Programs Hogging Resources



Asin
07-10-2005, 03:15 AM
Another thing that may or may not be worth noting is that my Dell Inspiron
600m is a powerful little thing.

Before the reformat and SP2 installation, I could easily be playing a flash
game in Firefox, have an audio file playing in the background in WMP 9, and
have multiple simultaneous downloads and/or uploads going in the background
on a resource hungry application which I choose to not reveal. This is all
done without lag/stutter.

So the problem with SP2 is that WMP 10 is consuming much more CPU usage than
it should. The same with Firefox or Internet Explorer when there is a flash
animation and perhaps other forms of multimedia, and downloads can't occur
with either WMP 10 or an Internet Browser in the background because of Sygate
and its CPU usage (~ 30 - 40%) when the download or upload is happening.

Sygate would once or twice a month spike to the levels that it constantly
does in SP2 while in SP1, but those are freak cases with some strange stuff
happening which I have yet to determine.

By the way, if I reformatted again and stuck with SP1, would I still be able
to receive critical updates or is it true that you will not be able to unless
you have SP2 installed? And what's this rumour floating around about SP2
being forced upon users regardless of whether or not they want it?

"Star Fleet Admiral Q" wrote:

> Walter,
> I have no issues with Macromedia Flash and/or Shockwave videos as mentioned
> by the OP, but I do have more extreme results with WMP as expressed by the
> OP.
>
> Responding to your questions:
>
> What is the problem? Read my post - you may can get a brief synopsis here,
> but more details are in the previous post.
>
> Do you understand the metric being measured? Yes, my experience includes
> managing networks and application development in a professional capacity for
> some 25+ years now.
>
> Can you no longer run other programs? yes, all 4 CPU's (HT Enabled) or 2
> CPU's (HT Disabled) are at 100% - unless task manager is up, you can't bring
> it up once a video starts, you must wait until it ends. The machine is
> essentially "locked up" until the video finishes.
>
> Does video playback stutter? No, it works perfectly, smooth, beautiful and
> real like, on either monitor.
>
> Can you no longer open other applications? Repeat question, although
> "programs" and "applications" have different meanings, in this situation the
> meaning would by synonymous, where in reality an application is something
> such as MS Office (a related group of programs), where a program would be
> word, excel, outlook etc. I don't tend to run all the MS Office Suite
> (application) programs simultaneously. Maybe word, excel and outlook. IIS
> 6.0, a development version of MS SQL2k SP4 is running, along with a
> firewall, AV software on the Win2k3 side, but I don't even have Office, IIS
> or SQL on the XP side, just a firewall and AV software.
>
> Does the system become sluggish/unusable? Yes, as stated above, unusable to
> be exact until the video is complete.
>
> I'm not done with my researching as I was just conversing with the "OP" as
> something may ring a bell between the two of us that could shed some light
> on a possible culprit. I do know one thing, WMP 10 playing a video should
> NOT peg 2xP4 HT Xeons at 100%, especially since this didn't happen with WMP
> 9, a video would barely use maybe 20-30% total of 1 CPU. The audio is just
> fine, it may use 5% of 1 CPU.
>
> I've the latest NVIDIA drivers loaded for my Quattro Pro4 512MB dual DVI
> video card, I've tried backing up a couple of versions, but either way, it
> boils down to video, but since Win2k3 SP1 and WinXP SP2 both come with WMP
> 10 integrated, there's not much choice in the matter.
>
> A WMP video being viewed via IE say from MSNBC is in no way as CPU intensive
> as some the examples provided in your feedback especially considering the
> horsepower the machine I'm working with.
>
> Bottom line there is an issue - I've just not narrowed it down to where lies
> in the culprit, but just for grins and giggles, I verified the problem with
> WMP 10 today, then after ghosting both installations, reloaded the last
> ghost image(s) of each OS (WinXP SP1 and Win2k3) as they were I did the
> clean install of both OS's with integrated SP2 and SP1 (respective to WinXP
> and Win2k3), and went back to MSNBC to view the same video - guess what, no
> issue, viewing the WMP 9 video only used maybe 20-30% max. Reimaged with
> WinXP SP2 and Win2k3 SP1, guess what, issues back - so my first logical
> elimination will be the hardware.
>
> --
>
> Star Fleet Admiral Q @ your Service!
>
> http://www.google.com
> Google is your "Friend"
>
> "Walter Clayton" <w-claytonNO@SPmvpsAM.org> wrote in message
> news:%23%23TA1pQVFHA.1384@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> > What is the problem? Do you understand the metric being measured?
> >
> > I have to play dense on this since I run BOINC on my desktop and laptop.
> > That means I run 100% processor utilization 100% of the time that the
> > machines are up in normal mode. I play processor and video intensive
> > games, watch TV, burn CDs/DVDs play movies, run multiple VMs, compile and
> > debug applications, run SQL both locally and cross platform, and don't
> > have any problems. And remember, I'm running 100% processor 100% of the
> > time.
> >
> > To repeat, setting aside what you think may be a problem due to some
> > misunderstood metric, what exactly do see that is problematic when this
> > 'problem' occurs? Can you no longer run other programs? Does video
> > playback stutter? Can you no longer open other applications? Does the
> > system become sluggish/unusable? Are you having to hard reset the machine
> > after any kind of video playback just so you launch, say, notepad?
> >
> > Is there an actual Mark I Eyeball problem or do you think simply think
> > there is one?
> >
> > --
> > Walter Clayton
> > Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
> >
> >
> > "Asin" <Asin@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > news:DC3749BB-54DA-43AF-8196-735C661C74E5@microsoft.com...
> >> While using various programs that have some sort of animation or video on
> >> screen, I find that that program tends to spike (and stay there) in the
> >> 30-60% range in terms of CPU usage. Examples: playing a video on Windows
> >> Media Player 10, displaying a page with a flash animation (or game) in
> >> Internet Explorer or Firefox, or playing a streaming video in Internet
> >> Explorer via Windows Media Player.
> >>
> >> I have yet to thoroughly test this, but I believe that it occurs with all
> >> video-related software when it's active. Audio tests seem to produce
> >> normal
> >> (below 5%) CPU usages.
> >>
> >> The video card drivers are up to date with respect to Windows Update and
> >> the
> >> manuafacturer's website and the BIOS was recently updated according to
> >> the
> >> manufacturer's website.
> >>
> >> It's an IBM ThinkPad T21 with Windows XP. SP2 is slipstreamed into the
> >> XP
> >> CD that was used for the installation. The same thing happens on an IBM
> >> ThinkPad T40 and a Dell Inspiron 600m. In the case of the Dell laptop,
> >> the
> >> CD used had SP1 slipstreamed into it and a SP2 CD was used for the
> >> upgrade.
> >>
> >> Even after a fresh installation of XP with SP2 slipstreamed onto a newly
> >> reformatted hard drive, the problem still exists. This would mean that
> >> the
> >> problem exists with SP2 as the problem is non-existant with a SP1 laptop.
> >>
> >> Sorry for the long post. Any help is greatly appreciated.
> >
>
>
>

Star Fleet Admiral Q
07-10-2005, 03:15 AM
Asin,
I believe only the original XP is no longer supported on the Update
site, but pretty sure XP with SP1/SP2 are still fully supported.

--

Star Fleet Admiral Q @ your Service!

http://www.google.com
Google is your "Friend"

"Asin" <Asin@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:7BAC963B-6BEE-4A03-9C90-F236C5BDB325@microsoft.com...
> Another thing that may or may not be worth noting is that my Dell Inspiron
> 600m is a powerful little thing.
>
> Before the reformat and SP2 installation, I could easily be playing a
> flash
> game in Firefox, have an audio file playing in the background in WMP 9,
> and
> have multiple simultaneous downloads and/or uploads going in the
> background
> on a resource hungry application which I choose to not reveal. This is
> all
> done without lag/stutter.
>
> So the problem with SP2 is that WMP 10 is consuming much more CPU usage
> than
> it should. The same with Firefox or Internet Explorer when there is a
> flash
> animation and perhaps other forms of multimedia, and downloads can't occur
> with either WMP 10 or an Internet Browser in the background because of
> Sygate
> and its CPU usage (~ 30 - 40%) when the download or upload is happening.
>
> Sygate would once or twice a month spike to the levels that it constantly
> does in SP2 while in SP1, but those are freak cases with some strange
> stuff
> happening which I have yet to determine.
>
> By the way, if I reformatted again and stuck with SP1, would I still be
> able
> to receive critical updates or is it true that you will not be able to
> unless
> you have SP2 installed? And what's this rumour floating around about SP2
> being forced upon users regardless of whether or not they want it?
>
> "Star Fleet Admiral Q" wrote:
>
>> Walter,
>> I have no issues with Macromedia Flash and/or Shockwave videos as
>> mentioned
>> by the OP, but I do have more extreme results with WMP as expressed by
>> the
>> OP.
>>
>> Responding to your questions:
>>
>> What is the problem? Read my post - you may can get a brief synopsis
>> here,
>> but more details are in the previous post.
>>
>> Do you understand the metric being measured? Yes, my experience includes
>> managing networks and application development in a professional capacity
>> for
>> some 25+ years now.
>>
>> Can you no longer run other programs? yes, all 4 CPU's (HT Enabled) or 2
>> CPU's (HT Disabled) are at 100% - unless task manager is up, you can't
>> bring
>> it up once a video starts, you must wait until it ends. The machine is
>> essentially "locked up" until the video finishes.
>>
>> Does video playback stutter? No, it works perfectly, smooth, beautiful
>> and
>> real like, on either monitor.
>>
>> Can you no longer open other applications? Repeat question, although
>> "programs" and "applications" have different meanings, in this situation
>> the
>> meaning would by synonymous, where in reality an application is something
>> such as MS Office (a related group of programs), where a program would be
>> word, excel, outlook etc. I don't tend to run all the MS Office Suite
>> (application) programs simultaneously. Maybe word, excel and outlook.
>> IIS
>> 6.0, a development version of MS SQL2k SP4 is running, along with a
>> firewall, AV software on the Win2k3 side, but I don't even have Office,
>> IIS
>> or SQL on the XP side, just a firewall and AV software.
>>
>> Does the system become sluggish/unusable? Yes, as stated above, unusable
>> to
>> be exact until the video is complete.
>>
>> I'm not done with my researching as I was just conversing with the "OP"
>> as
>> something may ring a bell between the two of us that could shed some
>> light
>> on a possible culprit. I do know one thing, WMP 10 playing a video
>> should
>> NOT peg 2xP4 HT Xeons at 100%, especially since this didn't happen with
>> WMP
>> 9, a video would barely use maybe 20-30% total of 1 CPU. The audio is
>> just
>> fine, it may use 5% of 1 CPU.
>>
>> I've the latest NVIDIA drivers loaded for my Quattro Pro4 512MB dual DVI
>> video card, I've tried backing up a couple of versions, but either way,
>> it
>> boils down to video, but since Win2k3 SP1 and WinXP SP2 both come with
>> WMP
>> 10 integrated, there's not much choice in the matter.
>>
>> A WMP video being viewed via IE say from MSNBC is in no way as CPU
>> intensive
>> as some the examples provided in your feedback especially considering the
>> horsepower the machine I'm working with.
>>
>> Bottom line there is an issue - I've just not narrowed it down to where
>> lies
>> in the culprit, but just for grins and giggles, I verified the problem
>> with
>> WMP 10 today, then after ghosting both installations, reloaded the last
>> ghost image(s) of each OS (WinXP SP1 and Win2k3) as they were I did the
>> clean install of both OS's with integrated SP2 and SP1 (respective to
>> WinXP
>> and Win2k3), and went back to MSNBC to view the same video - guess what,
>> no
>> issue, viewing the WMP 9 video only used maybe 20-30% max. Reimaged with
>> WinXP SP2 and Win2k3 SP1, guess what, issues back - so my first logical
>> elimination will be the hardware.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Star Fleet Admiral Q @ your Service!
>>
>> http://www.google.com
>> Google is your "Friend"
>>
>> "Walter Clayton" <w-claytonNO@SPmvpsAM.org> wrote in message
>> news:%23%23TA1pQVFHA.1384@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>> > What is the problem? Do you understand the metric being measured?
>> >
>> > I have to play dense on this since I run BOINC on my desktop and
>> > laptop.
>> > That means I run 100% processor utilization 100% of the time that the
>> > machines are up in normal mode. I play processor and video intensive
>> > games, watch TV, burn CDs/DVDs play movies, run multiple VMs, compile
>> > and
>> > debug applications, run SQL both locally and cross platform, and don't
>> > have any problems. And remember, I'm running 100% processor 100% of the
>> > time.
>> >
>> > To repeat, setting aside what you think may be a problem due to some
>> > misunderstood metric, what exactly do see that is problematic when this
>> > 'problem' occurs? Can you no longer run other programs? Does video
>> > playback stutter? Can you no longer open other applications? Does the
>> > system become sluggish/unusable? Are you having to hard reset the
>> > machine
>> > after any kind of video playback just so you launch, say, notepad?
>> >
>> > Is there an actual Mark I Eyeball problem or do you think simply think
>> > there is one?
>> >
>> > --
>> > Walter Clayton
>> > Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
>> >
>> >
>> > "Asin" <Asin@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> > news:DC3749BB-54DA-43AF-8196-735C661C74E5@microsoft.com...
>> >> While using various programs that have some sort of animation or video
>> >> on
>> >> screen, I find that that program tends to spike (and stay there) in
>> >> the
>> >> 30-60% range in terms of CPU usage. Examples: playing a video on
>> >> Windows
>> >> Media Player 10, displaying a page with a flash animation (or game) in
>> >> Internet Explorer or Firefox, or playing a streaming video in Internet
>> >> Explorer via Windows Media Player.
>> >>
>> >> I have yet to thoroughly test this, but I believe that it occurs with
>> >> all
>> >> video-related software when it's active. Audio tests seem to produce
>> >> normal
>> >> (below 5%) CPU usages.
>> >>
>> >> The video card drivers are up to date with respect to Windows Update
>> >> and
>> >> the
>> >> manuafacturer's website and the BIOS was recently updated according to
>> >> the
>> >> manufacturer's website.
>> >>
>> >> It's an IBM ThinkPad T21 with Windows XP. SP2 is slipstreamed into
>> >> the
>> >> XP
>> >> CD that was used for the installation. The same thing happens on an
>> >> IBM
>> >> ThinkPad T40 and a Dell Inspiron 600m. In the case of the Dell
>> >> laptop,
>> >> the
>> >> CD used had SP1 slipstreamed into it and a SP2 CD was used for the
>> >> upgrade.
>> >>
>> >> Even after a fresh installation of XP with SP2 slipstreamed onto a
>> >> newly
>> >> reformatted hard drive, the problem still exists. This would mean
>> >> that
>> >> the
>> >> problem exists with SP2 as the problem is non-existant with a SP1
>> >> laptop.
>> >>
>> >> Sorry for the long post. Any help is greatly appreciated.
>> >
>>
>>
>>

Asin
07-10-2005, 03:15 AM
That's good to know. In that case, I'm going to try and get my Dell back to
its factory fresh state and stick with SP1. Hopefully WMP 10 will work on it
as well as DirectX 9.0c.

"Star Fleet Admiral Q" wrote:

> Asin,
> I believe only the original XP is no longer supported on the Update
> site, but pretty sure XP with SP1/SP2 are still fully supported.
>
> --
>
> Star Fleet Admiral Q @ your Service!
>
> http://www.google.com
> Google is your "Friend"
>
> "Asin" <Asin@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:7BAC963B-6BEE-4A03-9C90-F236C5BDB325@microsoft.com...
> > Another thing that may or may not be worth noting is that my Dell Inspiron
> > 600m is a powerful little thing.
> >
> > Before the reformat and SP2 installation, I could easily be playing a
> > flash
> > game in Firefox, have an audio file playing in the background in WMP 9,
> > and
> > have multiple simultaneous downloads and/or uploads going in the
> > background
> > on a resource hungry application which I choose to not reveal. This is
> > all
> > done without lag/stutter.
> >
> > So the problem with SP2 is that WMP 10 is consuming much more CPU usage
> > than
> > it should. The same with Firefox or Internet Explorer when there is a
> > flash
> > animation and perhaps other forms of multimedia, and downloads can't occur
> > with either WMP 10 or an Internet Browser in the background because of
> > Sygate
> > and its CPU usage (~ 30 - 40%) when the download or upload is happening.
> >
> > Sygate would once or twice a month spike to the levels that it constantly
> > does in SP2 while in SP1, but those are freak cases with some strange
> > stuff
> > happening which I have yet to determine.
> >
> > By the way, if I reformatted again and stuck with SP1, would I still be
> > able
> > to receive critical updates or is it true that you will not be able to
> > unless
> > you have SP2 installed? And what's this rumour floating around about SP2
> > being forced upon users regardless of whether or not they want it?
> >
> > "Star Fleet Admiral Q" wrote:
> >
> >> Walter,
> >> I have no issues with Macromedia Flash and/or Shockwave videos as
> >> mentioned
> >> by the OP, but I do have more extreme results with WMP as expressed by
> >> the
> >> OP.
> >>
> >> Responding to your questions:
> >>
> >> What is the problem? Read my post - you may can get a brief synopsis
> >> here,
> >> but more details are in the previous post.
> >>
> >> Do you understand the metric being measured? Yes, my experience includes
> >> managing networks and application development in a professional capacity
> >> for
> >> some 25+ years now.
> >>
> >> Can you no longer run other programs? yes, all 4 CPU's (HT Enabled) or 2
> >> CPU's (HT Disabled) are at 100% - unless task manager is up, you can't
> >> bring
> >> it up once a video starts, you must wait until it ends. The machine is
> >> essentially "locked up" until the video finishes.
> >>
> >> Does video playback stutter? No, it works perfectly, smooth, beautiful
> >> and
> >> real like, on either monitor.
> >>
> >> Can you no longer open other applications? Repeat question, although
> >> "programs" and "applications" have different meanings, in this situation
> >> the
> >> meaning would by synonymous, where in reality an application is something
> >> such as MS Office (a related group of programs), where a program would be
> >> word, excel, outlook etc. I don't tend to run all the MS Office Suite
> >> (application) programs simultaneously. Maybe word, excel and outlook.
> >> IIS
> >> 6.0, a development version of MS SQL2k SP4 is running, along with a
> >> firewall, AV software on the Win2k3 side, but I don't even have Office,
> >> IIS
> >> or SQL on the XP side, just a firewall and AV software.
> >>
> >> Does the system become sluggish/unusable? Yes, as stated above, unusable
> >> to
> >> be exact until the video is complete.
> >>
> >> I'm not done with my researching as I was just conversing with the "OP"
> >> as
> >> something may ring a bell between the two of us that could shed some
> >> light
> >> on a possible culprit. I do know one thing, WMP 10 playing a video
> >> should
> >> NOT peg 2xP4 HT Xeons at 100%, especially since this didn't happen with
> >> WMP
> >> 9, a video would barely use maybe 20-30% total of 1 CPU. The audio is
> >> just
> >> fine, it may use 5% of 1 CPU.
> >>
> >> I've the latest NVIDIA drivers loaded for my Quattro Pro4 512MB dual DVI
> >> video card, I've tried backing up a couple of versions, but either way,
> >> it
> >> boils down to video, but since Win2k3 SP1 and WinXP SP2 both come with
> >> WMP
> >> 10 integrated, there's not much choice in the matter.
> >>
> >> A WMP video being viewed via IE say from MSNBC is in no way as CPU
> >> intensive
> >> as some the examples provided in your feedback especially considering the
> >> horsepower the machine I'm working with.
> >>
> >> Bottom line there is an issue - I've just not narrowed it down to where
> >> lies
> >> in the culprit, but just for grins and giggles, I verified the problem
> >> with
> >> WMP 10 today, then after ghosting both installations, reloaded the last
> >> ghost image(s) of each OS (WinXP SP1 and Win2k3) as they were I did the
> >> clean install of both OS's with integrated SP2 and SP1 (respective to
> >> WinXP
> >> and Win2k3), and went back to MSNBC to view the same video - guess what,
> >> no
> >> issue, viewing the WMP 9 video only used maybe 20-30% max. Reimaged with
> >> WinXP SP2 and Win2k3 SP1, guess what, issues back - so my first logical
> >> elimination will be the hardware.
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Star Fleet Admiral Q @ your Service!
> >>
> >> http://www.google.com
> >> Google is your "Friend"
> >>
> >> "Walter Clayton" <w-claytonNO@SPmvpsAM.org> wrote in message
> >> news:%23%23TA1pQVFHA.1384@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> >> > What is the problem? Do you understand the metric being measured?
> >> >
> >> > I have to play dense on this since I run BOINC on my desktop and
> >> > laptop.
> >> > That means I run 100% processor utilization 100% of the time that the
> >> > machines are up in normal mode. I play processor and video intensive
> >> > games, watch TV, burn CDs/DVDs play movies, run multiple VMs, compile
> >> > and
> >> > debug applications, run SQL both locally and cross platform, and don't
> >> > have any problems. And remember, I'm running 100% processor 100% of the
> >> > time.
> >> >
> >> > To repeat, setting aside what you think may be a problem due to some
> >> > misunderstood metric, what exactly do see that is problematic when this
> >> > 'problem' occurs? Can you no longer run other programs? Does video
> >> > playback stutter? Can you no longer open other applications? Does the
> >> > system become sluggish/unusable? Are you having to hard reset the
> >> > machine
> >> > after any kind of video playback just so you launch, say, notepad?
> >> >
> >> > Is there an actual Mark I Eyeball problem or do you think simply think
> >> > there is one?
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Walter Clayton
> >> > Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Asin" <Asin@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> >> > news:DC3749BB-54DA-43AF-8196-735C661C74E5@microsoft.com...
> >> >> While using various programs that have some sort of animation or video
> >> >> on
> >> >> screen, I find that that program tends to spike (and stay there) in
> >> >> the
> >> >> 30-60% range in terms of CPU usage. Examples: playing a video on
> >> >> Windows
> >> >> Media Player 10, displaying a page with a flash animation (or game) in
> >> >> Internet Explorer or Firefox, or playing a streaming video in Internet
> >> >> Explorer via Windows Media Player.
> >> >>
> >> >> I have yet to thoroughly test this, but I believe that it occurs with
> >> >> all
> >> >> video-related software when it's active. Audio tests seem to produce
> >> >> normal
> >> >> (below 5%) CPU usages.
> >> >>
> >> >> The video card drivers are up to date with respect to Windows Update
> >> >> and
> >> >> the
> >> >> manuafacturer's website and the BIOS was recently updated according to
> >> >> the
> >> >> manufacturer's website.
> >> >>
> >> >> It's an IBM ThinkPad T21 with Windows XP. SP2 is slipstreamed into
> >> >> the
> >> >> XP
> >> >> CD that was used for the installation. The same thing happens on an
> >> >> IBM
> >> >> ThinkPad T40 and a Dell Inspiron 600m. In the case of the Dell
> >> >> laptop,
> >> >> the
> >> >> CD used had SP1 slipstreamed into it and a SP2 CD was used for the
> >> >> upgrade.
> >> >>
> >> >> Even after a fresh installation of XP with SP2 slipstreamed onto a
> >> >> newly
> >> >> reformatted hard drive, the problem still exists. This would mean
> >> >> that
> >> >> the
> >> >> problem exists with SP2 as the problem is non-existant with a SP1
> >> >> laptop.
> >> >>
> >> >> Sorry for the long post. Any help is greatly appreciated.
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>
>


Re: Programs Hogging Resources