The right way to set up 2 HDDs and 2 cd writers?



Jeff
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer as
secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard that
it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I thought i
would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four devices
please?
Ta muchly

Kerry Brown
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer as
>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard that
>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I thought i
>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four devices
>please?
> Ta muchly
>

You'll probably receive a lot of conflicting answers. It seems to work
differently with different hardware. If all your hardware is fairly new and
conforms to the current standards then theoretically it shouldn't make any
difference how you hook them up. In the real world I usually hook up hard
drives on one cable and other drives on a different cable and have had no
problems. Make sure both cables are 80 pin not 40 pin cables. If you want
that last 1% of performance you'll have to find a hard drive bench mark or
devise your own and test all the different combinations :-)

Kerry

Ted Zieglar
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be sure to
carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.

--
Ted Zieglar
"You can do it if you try."

"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
> I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
as
> secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard that
> it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I thought
i
> would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
> slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
devices
> please?
> Ta muchly
>
>

Jeff
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that

"Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be sure
> to
> carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>
> --
> Ted Zieglar
> "You can do it if you try."
>
> "Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
> news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>> I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
> as
>> secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>> that
>> it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I thought
> i
>> would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
>> slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
> devices
>> please?
>> Ta muchly
>>
>>
>
>

Bob I
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.

Jeff wrote:

> Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
>
> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>
>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be sure
>>to
>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>>
>>--
>>Ted Zieglar
>>"You can do it if you try."
>>
>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>
>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
>>
>>as
>>
>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>that
>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I thought
>>
>>i
>>
>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
>>
>>devices
>>
>>>please?
>>>Ta muchly
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

George K
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the boot
HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have connected
the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as Secondary in
position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a DVD
R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD and
HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first. If the
operating system works, basically any configuration will work although
performance can be improved or reduced depending on the configuration, and
if required the boot drive can be changed to the second HDD and that system
can be used to salvage data files from the primary boot drive after a
catastrophic failure.


"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
>
> Jeff wrote:
>
>> Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
>>
>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>
>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be sure
>>>to
>>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>>>
>>>--
>>>Ted Zieglar
>>>"You can do it if you try."
>>>
>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>
>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
>>>
>>>as
>>>
>>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>>that
>>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>>thought
>>>
>>>i
>>>
>>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master and
>>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
>>>
>>>devices
>>>
>>>>please?
>>>>Ta muchly
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>

Richard Urban
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
A bit confusing Kerry. You do mean 80 "wire" and NOT 80 pin. (-:

There are no 80 pin connectors available for IDE connections. An 80
conductor wire still connects to the standard 40 pin receptacle on the M/B.
The 40 additional ground wires all terminate at 1 (one) of the 40 available
pins in the receptacle!

--
Regards,

Richard Urban

aka Crusty (-: Old B@stard :-)

If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!


"Kerry Brown" <kerry@kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote in message
news:OH1i5HiYFHA.1368@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
> "Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
> news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
>>as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as
>>master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all
>>four devices please?
>> Ta muchly
>>
>
> You'll probably receive a lot of conflicting answers. It seems to work
> differently with different hardware. If all your hardware is fairly new
> and conforms to the current standards then theoretically it shouldn't make
> any difference how you hook them up. In the real world I usually hook up
> hard drives on one cable and other drives on a different cable and have
> had no problems. Make sure both cables are 80 pin not 40 pin cables. If
> you want that last 1% of performance you'll have to find a hard drive
> bench mark or devise your own and test all the different combinations :-)
>
> Kerry
>
>

Kerry Brown
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
"Richard Urban" <richardurbanREMOVETHIS@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:evBo8pqYFHA.3660@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>A bit confusing Kerry. You do mean 80 "wire" and NOT 80 pin. (-:
>
> There are no 80 pin connectors available for IDE connections. An 80
> conductor wire still connects to the standard 40 pin receptacle on the
> M/B. The 40 additional ground wires all terminate at 1 (one) of the 40
> available pins in the receptacle!
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Richard Urban

Of course you are right. Thanks for the correction. I was in a hurry
yesterday, very busy day. I had a lot of work to catch up on and just as I
started UPS showed up with a new m/b, CPU, and fancy BTX case from Intel.
Had to get the work done before I could play with the new stuff. Can't make
up my mind if I should put Linux or XP MCE on the new box. The BTX case
looks like it will fit right in with my stereo system :-)

Kerry


>
> aka Crusty (-: Old B@stard :-)
>
> If you knew as much as you think you know,
> You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!
>
>
> "Kerry Brown" <kerry@kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote in message
> news:OH1i5HiYFHA.1368@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
>> "Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>> news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd writer
>>>as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as
>>>master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all
>>>four devices please?
>>> Ta muchly
>>>
>>
>> You'll probably receive a lot of conflicting answers. It seems to work
>> differently with different hardware. If all your hardware is fairly new
>> and conforms to the current standards then theoretically it shouldn't
>> make any difference how you hook them up. In the real world I usually
>> hook up hard drives on one cable and other drives on a different cable
>> and have had no problems. Make sure both cables are 80 pin not 40 pin
>> cables. If you want that last 1% of performance you'll have to find a
>> hard drive bench mark or devise your own and test all the different
>> combinations :-)
>>
>> Kerry
>>
>>
>
>

Yves Leclerc
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE cable as
the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using the
Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will slow
down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.

If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy an
additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical drives.


"George K" <gakingjr@charter.net> wrote in message
news:ugONcrjYFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the boot
> HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have
> connected the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as
> Secondary in position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
> The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
> CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a DVD
> R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
> On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD and
> HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first. If
> the operating system works, basically any configuration will work although
> performance can be improved or reduced depending on the configuration, and
> if required the boot drive can be changed to the second HDD and that
> system can be used to salvage data files from the primary boot drive after
> a catastrophic failure.
>
>
> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
>>
>> Jeff wrote:
>>
>>> Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
>>>
>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>
>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be sure
>>>>to
>>>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Ted Zieglar
>>>>"You can do it if you try."
>>>>
>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>>
>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>>>>>writer
>>>>
>>>>as
>>>>
>>>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>>>that
>>>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>>>thought
>>>>
>>>>i
>>>>
>>>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master
>>>>>and
>>>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
>>>>
>>>>devices
>>>>
>>>>>please?
>>>>>Ta muchly
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>

Anna
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
>>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>>>>>writer as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and
>>>>>have heard
>>>>>>that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>>>>thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable
>>>>>>as master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set
>>>>>>up all four
>>>>>devices?


>> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.


>>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
>>>>>sure to carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be
>>>>>all set.
>>>>>Ted Zieglar


"Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE cable
> as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using the
> Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
> slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
>
> If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy an
> additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
> drives.


Jeff:
If you're still around...

As far as connecting your IDE/ATAPI devices, i.e., your hard drives and
optical drives; other than connecting your
booting HD as Primary Master (in nearly all cases), it will usually make
little difference performance-wise how the remainder of your devices are
connected to the motherboard's IDE connectors. There is no "general rule"
stating you should not connect your CD/DVD-ROM or burner on the same IDE
cable as your booting HD. I know you will hear & read (as you already have)
that this or that drive should be connected to this or that IDE connector
for better performance but in tests carried out by the computer facility I
was associated with, we found that in virtually every case (there *were*
some very rare exceptions) it simply didn't matter. And it's easy enough to
conduct your own tests on the particular machine you're using to verify
this. Do so. Connect your devices in every conceivable configuration and
while performing your day-to-day computer operations, e.g., CD disk copying,
moving/copying large amounts of data between drives, photo/video editing
processes, etc., determine if you experience any performance issues
depending upon the devices' connections. And if so, connect your devices
accordingly.
Anna

Ted Zieglar
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
I'm glad this discussion came up. I also have heard conflicting advice on
how devices should be connected.

The only "rule" seems to be that the booting hard disk is the primary device
on the first IDE channel. It used to be that you weren't supposed to put a
hard drive and an optical drive on the same IDE cable. Apparently, that is
no longer correct, at least not since 80-wire IDE cables replaced 40-wire
cables. But I have also read that 80-wire cables make no difference; and
hard drives and optical drives should still be on separate cables.

All of this may be academic, since SATA drives are becoming ubiquitous. But
I would like someone to straighten me out on this, if only for my own
interest.
--
Ted Zieglar
"You can do it if you try."

"Anna" <myname@myisp.net> wrote in message
news:O8fb0UtYFHA.2996@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
> >>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
> >>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
> >>>>>writer as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and
> >>>>>have heard
> >>>>>>that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus.
I
> >>>>>>thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable
> >>>>>>as master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to
set
> >>>>>>up all four
> >>>>>devices?
>
>
> >> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
> >>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
>
>
> >>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
> >>>>>sure to carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be
> >>>>>all set.
> >>>>>Ted Zieglar
>
>
> "Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
> news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> > The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE
cable
> > as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using
the
> > Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
> > slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
> >
> > If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy
an
> > additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
> > drives.
>
>
> Jeff:
> If you're still around...
>
> As far as connecting your IDE/ATAPI devices, i.e., your hard drives and
> optical drives; other than connecting your
> booting HD as Primary Master (in nearly all cases), it will usually make
> little difference performance-wise how the remainder of your devices are
> connected to the motherboard's IDE connectors. There is no "general rule"
> stating you should not connect your CD/DVD-ROM or burner on the same IDE
> cable as your booting HD. I know you will hear & read (as you already
have)
> that this or that drive should be connected to this or that IDE connector
> for better performance but in tests carried out by the computer facility I
> was associated with, we found that in virtually every case (there *were*
> some very rare exceptions) it simply didn't matter. And it's easy enough
to
> conduct your own tests on the particular machine you're using to verify
> this. Do so. Connect your devices in every conceivable configuration and
> while performing your day-to-day computer operations, e.g., CD disk
copying,
> moving/copying large amounts of data between drives, photo/video editing
> processes, etc., determine if you experience any performance issues
> depending upon the devices' connections. And if so, connect your devices
> accordingly.
> Anna
>
>

Anna
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
>> >>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>> >>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>> >>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>> >>>>>writer as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and
>> >>>>>have heard
>> >>>>>>that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus.
> I thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable
>> as master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to
> set up all four devices?


>> >> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to
>> >>>AVIOD
>> >>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.


>> >>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
>> >>>>>sure to carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be
>> >>>>>all set.
>> >>>>>Ted Zieglar


>> "Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
>> news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> > The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE
> cable as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be
> using
> the Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
>> > slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
>> >
>> > If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy
> an additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
>> > drives.


> "Anna" <myname@myisp.net> wrote in message
>> Jeff:
>> If you're still around...
>>
>> As far as connecting your IDE/ATAPI devices, i.e., your hard drives and
>> optical drives; other than connecting your
>> booting HD as Primary Master (in nearly all cases), it will usually make
>> little difference performance-wise how the remainder of your devices are
>> connected to the motherboard's IDE connectors. There is no "general rule"
>> stating you should not connect your CD/DVD-ROM or burner on the same IDE
>> cable as your booting HD. I know you will hear & read (as you already
> > have) that this or that drive should be connected to this or that IDE
> > connector
>> for better performance but in tests carried out by the computer facility
>> I
>> was associated with, we found that in virtually every case (there *were*
>> some very rare exceptions) it simply didn't matter. And it's easy enough
>> to conduct your own tests on the particular machine you're using to
>> verify
>> this. Do so. Connect your devices in every conceivable configuration and
>> while performing your day-to-day computer operations, e.g., CD disk
> copying, moving/copying large amounts of data between drives, photo/video
> editing
>> processes, etc., determine if you experience any performance issues
>> depending upon the devices' connections. And if so, connect your devices
>> accordingly.
>> Anna


"Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
news:Ou3zSotYFHA.612@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> I'm glad this discussion came up. I also have heard conflicting advice on
> how devices should be connected.
>
> The only "rule" seems to be that the booting hard disk is the primary
> device
> on the first IDE channel. It used to be that you weren't supposed to put a
> hard drive and an optical drive on the same IDE cable. Apparently, that is
> no longer correct, at least not since 80-wire IDE cables replaced 40-wire
> cables. But I have also read that 80-wire cables make no difference; and
> hard drives and optical drives should still be on separate cables.
>
> All of this may be academic, since SATA drives are becoming ubiquitous.
> But
> I would like someone to straighten me out on this, if only for my own
> interest.
> --
> Ted Zieglar


Ted:
Even the "rule" you mention isn't a "rule". Most (but not all) motherboards
will have no problem booting from a bootable PATA HD that's connected on
*any* IDE channel. Of course, in all cases that I'm familiar with, the
system will first look to the Primary Master position and should it find a
bootable drive there, it will boot to it. But you can connect a bootable HD
as Secondary Master and the system will (usually) boot to it without any
problem. (I say "usually* because in a few cases we have encountered
motherboards that would *only* boot to a drive connected as PM). We
frequently have occasion to set up desktop computers with one internal HD
and one removable HD. We connect the internal drive (in this case the backup
drive) as Secondary Master and the removable HD (the day-to-day working
drive) as Primary Master. Using this configuration we can easily boot to
either drive as the situation warrants.

The 80-wire IDE cable was developed primarily to support the Cable Select
configuration. It also has the capability of significantly reducing
"crosstalk" between hard drives which can result in data corruption. We use
*only* 80-wire cables to connect *all* our IDE/ATAPI devices.

And you're right about the SATA drives making (eventually) all of this
moot...
Anna

Bill Ridgeway
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
Pardon my ignorance but what is an optical CD?

My computer is set up -
PM - HD
PS - CDR
SM - HD
SS - DVD
and it all seems to work OK. If however you are suggesting that it would
beneficial for the two HDs to be set as PM & PS I will change.

Regards.

Bill Ridgeway
Computer Solutions

"Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE cable
> as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using the
> Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
> slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
>
> If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy an
> additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
> drives.
>
>
> "George K" <gakingjr@charter.net> wrote in message
> news:ugONcrjYFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>> After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the boot
>> HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have
>> connected the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as
>> Secondary in position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
>> The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
>> CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a DVD
>> R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
>> On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD and
>> HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first. If
>> the operating system works, basically any configuration will work
>> although performance can be improved or reduced depending on the
>> configuration, and if required the boot drive can be changed to the
>> second HDD and that system can be used to salvage data files from the
>> primary boot drive after a catastrophic failure.
>>
>>
>> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
>>>
>>> Jeff wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
>>>>
>>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>
>>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
>>>>>sure to
>>>>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>Ted Zieglar
>>>>>"You can do it if you try."
>>>>>
>>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>>>
>>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>>>>>>writer
>>>>>
>>>>>as
>>>>>
>>>>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>>>>thought
>>>>>
>>>>>i
>>>>>
>>>>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master
>>>>>>and
>>>>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
>>>>>
>>>>>devices
>>>>>
>>>>>>please?
>>>>>>Ta muchly
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

Anna
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
>>>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>>>>>>>writer as secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and
>>>>>>>have heard that it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same
>>>>>>>IDE bus. I thought i would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the
>>>>>>>same cable as master and slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best
>>>>>>>way to set up all four
>>>>>>>devices please?

> "Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
> news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE cable
>> as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using
>> the Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed
>> will slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
>>
>> If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy an
>> additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
>> drives.
>>
>>
>> "George K" <gakingjr@charter.net> wrote in message
>> news:ugONcrjYFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>> After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the
>>> boot HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have
>>> connected the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as
>>> Secondary in position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
>>> The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
>>> CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a DVD
>>> R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
>>> On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD
>>> and HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first.
>>> If the operating system works, basically any configuration will work
>>> although performance can be improved or reduced depending on the
>>> configuration, and if required the boot drive can be changed to the
>>> second HDD and that system can be used to salvage data files from the
>>> primary boot drive after a catastrophic failure.


>>> "Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>>>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.


>>>>> "Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>
>>>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
>>>>>>sure to carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be
>>>>>>all set.
> I'm glad this discussion came up. I also have heard conflicting advice on
> how devices should be connected.
>
> The only "rule" seems to be that the booting hard disk is the primary
> device
> on the first IDE channel. It used to be that you weren't supposed to put a
> hard drive and an optical drive on the same IDE cable. Apparently, that is
> no longer correct, at least not since 80-wire IDE cables replaced 40-wire
> cables. But I have also read that 80-wire cables make no difference; and
> hard drives and optical drives should still be on separate cables.
>
> All of this may be academic, since SATA drives are becoming ubiquitous.
> But
> I would like someone to straighten me out on this, if only for my own
> interest.
>>>>>>Ted Zieglar


"Bill Ridgeway" <info@1001solutions.co.uk> wrote in message
news:d7847b$lmh$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Pardon my ignorance but what is an optical CD?
>
> My computer is set up -
> PM - HD
> PS - CDR
> SM - HD
> SS - DVD
> and it all seems to work OK. If however you are suggesting that it would
> beneficial for the two HDs to be set as PM & PS I will change.
>
> Bill Ridgeway
> Computer Solutions


Bill:
Your setup if fine. In general it's the configuration I prefer since, should
the need arise, you can boot to the HD Secondary Master following, of
course, disconnecting the Primary Master.

In case you didn't see my postings re this subject, here are my thoughts...
(To the OP)...
As far as connecting your IDE/ATAPI devices, i.e., your hard drives and
optical drives; other than connecting your booting HD as Primary Master (in
nearly all cases), it will usually make little difference performance-wise
how the remainder of your devices are connected to the motherboard's IDE
connectors. There is no "general rule"
stating you should not connect your CD/DVD-ROM or burner on the same IDE
cable as your booting HD. I know you will hear & read (as you already have)
that this or that drive should be connected to this or that IDE
connector for better performance but in tests carried out by the computer
facility I was associated with, we found that in virtually every case (there
*were* some very rare exceptions) it simply didn't matter. And it's easy
enough to conduct your own tests on the particular machine you're using to
verify this. Do so. Connect your devices in every conceivable configuration
and while performing your day-to-day computer operations, e.g., CD disk
copying, moving/copying large amounts of data between drives, photo/video
editing processes, etc., determine if you experience any performance issues
depending upon the devices' connections. And if so, connect your devices
accordingly.

(And to Ted)...
Ted:
Even the "rule" you mention isn't a "rule". Most (but not all) motherboards
will have no problem booting from a bootable PATA HD that's connected on
*any* IDE channel. Of course, in all cases that I'm familiar with, the
system will first look to the Primary Master position and should it find a
bootable drive there, it will boot to it. But you can connect a bootable HD
as Secondary Master and the system will (usually) boot to it without any
problem. (I say "usually* because in a few cases we have encountered
motherboards that would *only* boot to a drive connected as PM). We
frequently have occasion to set up desktop computers with one internal HD
and one removable HD. We connect the internal drive (in this case the backup
drive) as Secondary Master and the removable HD (the day-to-day working
drive) as Primary Master. Using this configuration we can easily boot to
either drive as the situation warrants.

The 80-wire IDE cable was developed primarily to support the Cable Select
configuration. It also has the capability of significantly reducing
"crosstalk" between hard drives which can result in data corruption. We use
*only* 80-wire cables to connect *all* our IDE/ATAPI devices.
And you're right about the SATA drives making (eventually) all of this
moot...
Anna

Bob I
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
A CD or a DVD is an optical drive. "optical CD" is redundant.

Bill Ridgeway wrote:

> Pardon my ignorance but what is an optical CD?
>
> My computer is set up -
> PM - HD
> PS - CDR
> SM - HD
> SS - DVD
> and it all seems to work OK. If however you are suggesting that it would
> beneficial for the two HDs to be set as PM & PS I will change.
>
> Regards.
>
> Bill Ridgeway
> Computer Solutions
>
> "Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
> news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>
>>The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE cable
>>as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using the
>>Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
>>slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
>>
>>If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy an
>>additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
>>drives.
>>
>>
>>"George K" <gakingjr@charter.net> wrote in message
>>news:ugONcrjYFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>>
>>>After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the boot
>>>HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have
>>>connected the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as
>>>Secondary in position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
>>>The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
>>>CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a DVD
>>>R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
>>>On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD and
>>>HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first. If
>>>the operating system works, basically any configuration will work
>>>although performance can be improved or reduced depending on the
>>>configuration, and if required the boot drive can be changed to the
>>>second HDD and that system can be used to salvage data files from the
>>>primary boot drive after a catastrophic failure.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>>
>>>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to AVIOD
>>>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
>>>>
>>>>Jeff wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
>>>>>
>>>>>"Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
>>>>>>sure to
>>>>>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all set.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>Ted Zieglar
>>>>>>"You can do it if you try."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
>>>>>>>writer
>>>>>>
>>>>>>as
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have heard
>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
>>>>>>>thought
>>>>>>
>>>>>>i
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as master
>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
>>>>>>
>>>>>>devices
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>please?
>>>>>>>Ta muchly
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>

Ted Zieglar
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
If I may stick my nose in...Optical media are read with a type of lens,
hence the term 'optical'. Basically, a laser beam is bounced off the 'pits
and lands' of the disk and into the lens, where the bursts of light are
translated into binary data. Any disk that is read in this way is called an
optical disk, and a drive that reads optical disks is, you guessed it, an
optical drive. A hard disk, by comparison, like a floppy disk or a ZIP disk,
is read by the 'read heads' sensing differences in the magnetic charges on
the surface of the disk. That's why thry're called magnetic drives.

Hey, not bad for a non-engineer. ;-)

--
Ted Zieglar
"You can do it if you try."

"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:OpjOHjeZFHA.796@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> A CD or a DVD is an optical drive. "optical CD" is redundant.
>
> Bill Ridgeway wrote:
>
> > Pardon my ignorance but what is an optical CD?
> >
> > My computer is set up -
> > PM - HD
> > PS - CDR
> > SM - HD
> > SS - DVD
> > and it all seems to work OK. If however you are suggesting that it
would
> > beneficial for the two HDs to be set as PM & PS I will change.
> >
> > Regards.
> >
> > Bill Ridgeway
> > Computer Solutions
> >
> > "Yves Leclerc" <yleclercNOSPAM@maysys.com> wrote in message
> > news:uXTlA2sYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >
> >>The only general rule is to not have any optical cd on the same IDE
cable
> >>as the primary boot hard drive. Usually, the hard drive will be using
the
> >>Ultra DMA settings to access the date. However, the access speed will
> >>slow down to match the slowest speed for the optical drive.
> >>
> >>If you still want to separate your optical drivers, you can always buy
an
> >>additional PCI IDE/ATA controller and use this card for your optical
> >>drives.
> >>
> >>
> >>"George K" <gakingjr@charter.net> wrote in message
> >>news:ugONcrjYFHA.3164@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> >>
> >>>After several bad experiences trying to reinstall XP when either the
boot
> >>>HDD or the CD-ROM was located on an IDE2 or IDE3 connector, I have
> >>>connected the CD-ROM as the Primary in position 0 and the boot HDD as
> >>>Secondary in position 1 (redundant) on the IDE1 connector.
> >>>The second HDD (which also has the XP OS, without any updates) and the
> >>>CD-R/RW are both set to cable select and are connected to IDE2 and a
DVD
> >>>R/RW is set to cable select and is connected to IDE3.
> >>>On a reinstall from a bootable copy of XP the system will see both CD
and
> >>>HDD and will not require any raid controllers to be installed first. If
> >>>the operating system works, basically any configuration will work
> >>>although performance can be improved or reduced depending on the
> >>>configuration, and if required the boot drive can be changed to the
> >>>second HDD and that system can be used to salvage data files from the
> >>>primary boot drive after a catastrophic failure.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >>>news:OfqhXYiYFHA.1040@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >>>
> >>>>I think it's more a case of burning CD's or DVD's that you try to
AVIOD
> >>>>having the source AND target on the SAME cable/channel.
> >>>>
> >>>>Jeff wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Hey thanks fellas, appreciate that
> >>>>>
> >>>>>"Ted Zieglar" <teddyz@notmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>>>news:%23TQ9HJiYFHA.2128@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>It's fine to have two optical drives on the same IDE cable. Just be
> >>>>>>sure to
> >>>>>>carefully follow the installation instructions and you'll be all
set.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>--
> >>>>>>Ted Zieglar
> >>>>>>"You can do it if you try."
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>"Jeff" <no_em@ilplea.se> wrote in message
> >>>>>>news:y6GdnZ2AXM_pjwvfRVnytw@eclipse.net.uk...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I currently have 2 HDDs set as primary master and slave, and a cd
> >>>>>>>writer
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>as
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>secondary master. I've just bought an IDE dvd writer, and have
heard
> >>>>>>>that
> >>>>>>>it's not good to have the 2 cd/dvd drives on the same IDE bus. I
> >>>>>>>thought
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>i
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>would just set the dvd and cd writers up on the same cable as
master
> >>>>>>>and
> >>>>>>>slave. Is this a bad idea? What's the best way to set up all four
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>devices
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>please?
> >>>>>>>Ta muchly
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
>

Bob I
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
And then there is the M-O disks, which read the magnetic alignment of
the disk surface optically.

Ted Zieglar wrote:

> If I may stick my nose in...Optical media are read with a type of lens,
> hence the term 'optical'. Basically, a laser beam is bounced off the 'pits
> and lands' of the disk and into the lens, where the bursts of light are
> translated into binary data. Any disk that is read in this way is called an
> optical disk, and a drive that reads optical disks is, you guessed it, an
> optical drive. A hard disk, by comparison, like a floppy disk or a ZIP disk,
> is read by the 'read heads' sensing differences in the magnetic charges on
> the surface of the disk. That's why thry're called magnetic drives.
>
> Hey, not bad for a non-engineer. ;-)
>

Ted Zieglar
07-10-2005, 12:52 AM
Right you are.

When I was growing up, 'M-O' was a laxative.

--
Ted Zieglar
"You can do it if you try."

"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:%23CxBD0qZFHA.2916@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> And then there is the M-O disks, which read the magnetic alignment of
> the disk surface optically.
>
> Ted Zieglar wrote:
>
> > If I may stick my nose in...Optical media are read with a type of lens,
> > hence the term 'optical'. Basically, a laser beam is bounced off the
'pits
> > and lands' of the disk and into the lens, where the bursts of light are
> > translated into binary data. Any disk that is read in this way is called
an
> > optical disk, and a drive that reads optical disks is, you guessed it,
an
> > optical drive. A hard disk, by comparison, like a floppy disk or a ZIP
disk,
> > is read by the 'read heads' sensing differences in the magnetic charges
on
> > the surface of the disk. That's why thry're called magnetic drives.
> >
> > Hey, not bad for a non-engineer. ;-)
> >
>


The right way to set up 2 HDDs and 2 cd writers?